An Interview with Isabel De Obaldía

Edward J. Sullivan

Edward J. Sullivan: In a country like yours where there is very little in the way of a sculptural tradition—and even less one of glass sculpture—are you concerned that you’re doing something completely unknown in Panamanian art?

Isabel De Obaldía: Well, I have done some sculpture prior to this...in clay and, when I was very young I did some papier-mâché sculpture. I’ve always been interested in sculpture, including woodcarvings. What I like about glass is something that almost all glass artists talk about: the color, the light, the transparency. I don’t think I could have gone into bronze. However, I do like stone and there’s something about glass sculpture that’s like stone. You can cut it and refine it, like stone. It’s the interplay of texture, color and light that I like with glass.

EJS: Do you feel that your work in glass with the figure is a natural outgrowth of similar interests that you express in your painting and drawing?

IDO: Completely. I am attracted to glass among other things for its fragility. In my painting I deal with this fragility of the human form and do the same thing with glass. There are very few glass artists doing work with the human figure. You really have to know why you want to do it in order to begin.

EJS: How do you choose your themes?

IDO: I can’t really say how. This exhibition, like every other one, represents a strange thing for me. You work and work and only when you see all of the pieces assembled together do you realize what it was you were trying to do and what the show will be all about.

EJS: Each one of these pieces is unique yet each seems to have references to the past and to history. Are these references conscious?

IDO: Yes, absolutely. As you said, there’s no real sculptural tradition in Panama, so I look at everything I can. Some of my pieces have a very pre-Columbian influence. I also like Greek and Roman sculpture. I have looked a lot at Rodin, among others, and what I do is my own interpretation of these sources in a very respectful way.  Yet, the more works I do, the more personal they’re becoming—more and more like my paintings.

EJS: Is there a relationship between the way you use color in your two-dimensional work and the way you use it in your sculpture?

IDO: No, not really, but color is natural to me. The thing about glass and color is that you can’t really control it. When I pour the glass I don’t really know what will happen. It’s always a bit of an accident. These unexpected aspects can be very good and you can work around them afterwards.

EJS: Where do you do most of your work?

IDO: My studio is in the garden of my house in Panama City. I also work outside the studio, doing a lot of the mold-making process in the out-of-doors. I have one person to help me to do the molds because there’s a lot of messy work to do but, for the time being, I don’t want any assistants doing any of the real work with me. I feel that I’m at a state where I’m still learning and I’d rather do everything myself.

EJS: What are the glass-making traditions that you’ve been looking at?

IDO: In the past I’ve liked, for instance, Art Nouveau such as the animal forms, the leaf forms designed by Emile Gallé. Right now, though, I’m not looking so much at specific glass traditions being developed today. It’s hard since I don’t live in a community with lots of other glass artists. I’d rather look at sculpture and learn from that...I’m interested in contemporary sculpture in which the human forms is done in very simple, schematic ways. It’s very nice in a way, to be able to work, as I do, isolated from other artists.

EJS: Do you have any interest in working in large scale in your glass pieces?

IDO: For now I’m very interested in engraving onto my pieces and you could never really do that with very large glass sculptures. I like the type of work I’m doing now because the pieces are more intimate. Maybe in the future I’d like to work in a larger format, but I’d have to have very different equipment. I admire, for instance, the monumental work of Howard Ben Tré, one of the few glass artists working on a very large scale.

EJS: So many contemporary glass artists seem to work with color as a decorative element. In your work, however, there’s more of a sense of earthiness and rawness, almost as if color could have been there by accident. Is this earthiness something that you have been striving for?

IDO: No, I’m not looking for it consciously. It just happens. I don’t want my pieces to be shiny or beautiful. I’m not striving for the technically perfect image.

EJS: Have you ever looked at Latin American colonial sculpture with its shiny surfaces?

IDO: Yes, it’s very important for me. I’m attracted by it and have several pieces in my house in Panama. I like the fact that those sculptures are assembled. One piece of the wood is hinged to the next and I admire the colors.

EJS: Tell me a bit more about your studies when you were first starting out.

IDO: One ironic story about my student days is about my time at RISD (Rhode Island School of Design). When I was there, Dale Chihuly had just come onto the faculty and everyone assumes that I had studied with him but that wasn’t the case. There was only a very small group of about ten people who were his students. I actually wasn’t attracted to the medium then. I studied graphic design and then went into film. I always drew a lot, and then I started painting.

EJS: Do you feel part of an artistic community in Panama?

IDO: Yes, of course all of the artists know one another, but it’s not like in other countries where the artists get together and communicate a lot with each other...although we’re moving in that direction and that’s good.

EJS: Do you feel more in touch with other glass artists?

IDO: Oh, yes. Among other glass artists, we have to share with each other and that’s good.

EJS: Do you travel to see some of the other glass artists?

IDO: Maybe once or twice a year. I haven’t been to Pilchuk, where I studied, for several years. Last year, though, there was a major glass show in Venice. I was invited first to submit slides by the director of the Centre des Arts Decoratifs in Paris, who I had met, and then he, as one of the organizers of the biennial, sent them to Venice and ultimately I was invited. That was such a big, important event and it was nice to meet so many other glass artists.

EJS: Do you find that you’re doing many things in common with artists in Europe, for instance?

IDO: Yes, there are some others in Europe who are doing sand casting that I’m interested in and I feel that I have things in common with them. There are some Czech artists who are doing very large, geometric glass pieces that I admire.

EJS: Are there any other glass artists in Latin America that you’re in touch with?

IDO: I know that there are some but I’m not really in contact with them.

EJS: Are the collectors of your glass pieces mainly in Panama?

IDO: Not exclusively, though there are some collectors who have several pieces of mine. There are also pieces in the US and in Europe.

EJS: What are some of the basic characteristics of your technique in making the glass pieces?

IDO: I start with a clay mold, then I make a wooden box into which I pour a mixture of plaster and silica. After the mold is dry I take out the clay from the mold and then I put the chunks or pieces of glass with the colors that I want in the kiln. Depending on the thickness of the piece, you have to leave the simpler ones for five days and the more complex ones up to fourteen days. It’s risky. You might think that the piece is going to come out fine but if you didn’t leave it long enough in the kiln and you start working with the machines to polish or engrave it and there’s maybe a little tension there, it could easily crack. That’s happened to me on several occasions.

EJS: How long does the whole process take?

IDO: To make the clay, one to two days and then the mold would bring it up to a week, more or less and then the time in the kiln and then, depending on how much you want to engrave it, it could take a good deal longer.

EJS: It’s a very different process from other arts. In your paintings there’s so much spontaneity. Do you think that you can preserve any of that spontaneity in your glass?

IDO: Yes, in the most recent things I’ve been doing, I think so. When there’s a little accident or something happens to the piece that I didn’t expect, I play with it and see what I can make of it. This is especially true when I’m engraving it. I can be more spontaneous.

EJS: What are the techniques you use for the engravings?

IDO: I use a lathe with different diamond wheels and you change the wheels for different effects.

EJS: How do you divide your time? Do you have certain months of the year when you’ll do only painting or only sculpture?

IDO: Before, I tried to do both simultaneously, but now I realize that I can’t. I’d rather dedicate six months to a whole series of sculptures, for instance and the other six months for paintings, It’s ultimately better for the work. But basically I’m always drawing. You always have to start with drawing for anything.

EJS: Why are there so few figures of women in your sculpture?

IDO: I don’t know. I guess I find the male form more interesting.

EJS: Does the figure of the shark have any special meaning? You’ve done several sculptures of sharks.

IDO: I’ve used the shark a lot in my painting. I like the shark figure, the hammerhead shark in particular. I do a lot of scuba and skin diving and I think about sharks a lot. It’s something that I’m afraid of.

New York City, September 18, 1997